Royale name

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Royale name

Mandeep Sarma
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutin allure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.

Mandeep

Virus-free. www.avg.com
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Re: Royale name

Carlos Rovira
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutin allure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.

Mandeep

Virus-free. www.avg.com



--

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: +34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com


Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!


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De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.


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Re: Royale name

Mandeep Sarma
my opinion is not important, 1 person does not make a focus group. I learned of the name change today because someone approached the company I work for to discuss a Flex app conversion. But a search with Google Trends may give more insight.

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Carlos Rovira <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutin allure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.

Mandeep

Virus-free. www.avg.com



--

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: <a href="tel:+34%20607%2022%2060%2005" value="+34607226005" target="_blank">+34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com


Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!


Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.

De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.



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Re: Royale name

Mandeep Sarma
I know it's too late and I'm really not trying to be a pest, but as a marketing guy I wanted to add in this discussion topic (http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/DISCUSS-Name-of-the-FlexJS-Fork-td64199i60.html#a64289) Justin M. Hill makes the most sense. Even people who no longer use Flex would probably know what FlexJS could be about (like me) but Apache Royale? I had a quick look at the subscribers of the Apache Flex User mailing list even they seem confused, imagine the rest of us.
Google Trends indicates to me Royale 1. is not a widely used term, 2. the searched term does not seem to have a significant relation with computing (except for a game).

Mandeep

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 7:50 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:
my opinion is not important, 1 person does not make a focus group. I learned of the name change today because someone approached the company I work for to discuss a Flex app conversion. But a search with Google Trends may give more insight.

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Carlos Rovira <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutin allure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.

Mandeep

Virus-free. www.avg.com



--

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: <a href="tel:+34%20607%2022%2060%2005" value="+34607226005" target="_blank">+34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com


Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!


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De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.




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Re: Royale name

Alex Harui-2
Hi Mandeep,

IMO, there are two target markets for Royale:  1) people migrating Flex apps.  2) People looking to create new JS apps who have no idea what Flex is or think Flex is "old".

Also, at least at Apache, there can a difference between a PROJECT name and a PRODUCT name.

As you can see from the discussion, folks looking to target the second group are concerned about association with the name "Flex".  I could be wrong, but I am hopeful that the big push to migrate Flex apps will not last much beyond 2020.  It is extremely difficult to rebrand and rename a PROJECT "later", so we gambled and picked a name for the PROJECT that had no association with "Flex".  However, I am still pushing for us to have a PRODUCT named FlexJS as well as a PRODUCT named Royale in order to target both groups.  And, if the FlexJS PRODUCT isn't of interest to many folks after 2020, we can retire that one PRODUCT without having to rebrand the PROJECT.

We simply have not published enough stuff on any official web sites in order to get the search engines to find us in the noise, so yeah, we are currently hard to find.  We are always interested in volunteers helping out in drawing attention to Royale.

And we are always interested in your and other's thoughts on everything related to Royale, including your posts on this topic.  The only thing that is unlikely to change is the PROJECT name, but you can still influence PRODUCT names and how we market.

Thoughts?
-Alex

From: Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Date: Monday, October 23, 2017 at 9:33 PM
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Royale name

I know it's too late and I'm really not trying to be a pest, but as a marketing guy I wanted to add in this discussion topic (http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/DISCUSS-Name-of-the-FlexJS-Fork-td64199i60.html#a64289) Justin M. Hill makes the most sense. Even people who no longer use Flex would probably know what FlexJS could be about (like me) but Apache Royale? I had a quick look at the subscribers of the Apache Flex User mailing list even they seem confused, imagine the rest of us.
Google Trends indicates to me Royale 1. is not a widely used term, 2. the searched term does not seem to have a significant relation with computing (except for a game).

Mandeep

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 7:50 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:
my opinion is not important, 1 person does not make a focus group. I learned of the name change today because someone approached the company I work for to discuss a Flex app conversion. But a search with Google Trends may give more insight.

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Carlos Rovira <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutinallure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.

Mandeep

Virus-free. www.avg.com



--

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: <a href="tel:&#43;34%20607%2022%2060%2005" value="&#43;34607226005" target="_blank">+34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com


Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!


Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.

De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.




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RE: Royale name

Idylog - Nicolas Granon
Many thanks for this information.
I must say that the distinction was not very clear to me neither…

Maybe there is some confusion between the “Flex” concept (most people outside Flex developers never heard about it, and Flex developers usually have a good feeling about it) and the “Flash Player” concept (about which absolutely everybody have heard of, as being “bad” and “old” and “evil” and “anti-Apple” thus being anti-anything-modern since Apple equals “modern” in the mind of the public).

That is the reason why I do not believe that citing Flex necessarily associates it with “old” (after all, js is much older!).
What we want is something AS3 + MXML, keeping what made Flex shine, but definitely “Flash Player-free”. Maybe a “Flash Player free” sticker would attract more users ?

Nicolas Granon



De : Alex Harui [mailto:[hidden email]]
Envoyé : mardi 24 octobre 2017 07:05
À : [hidden email]
Objet : Re: Royale name

Hi Mandeep,

IMO, there are two target markets for Royale:  1) people migrating Flex apps.  2) People looking to create new JS apps who have no idea what Flex is or think Flex is "old".

Also, at least at Apache, there can a difference between a PROJECT name and a PRODUCT name.

As you can see from the discussion, folks looking to target the second group are concerned about association with the name "Flex".  I could be wrong, but I am hopeful that the big push to migrate Flex apps will not last much beyond 2020.  It is extremely difficult to rebrand and rename a PROJECT "later", so we gambled and picked a name for the PROJECT that had no association with "Flex".  However, I am still pushing for us to have a PRODUCT named FlexJS as well as a PRODUCT named Royale in order to target both groups.  And, if the FlexJS PRODUCT isn't of interest to many folks after 2020, we can retire that one PRODUCT without having to rebrand the PROJECT.

We simply have not published enough stuff on any official web sites in order to get the search engines to find us in the noise, so yeah, we are currently hard to find.  We are always interested in volunteers helping out in drawing attention to Royale.

And we are always interested in your and other's thoughts on everything related to Royale, including your posts on this topic.  The only thing that is unlikely to change is the PROJECT name, but you can still influence PRODUCT names and how we market.

Thoughts?
-Alex

From: Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Date: Monday, October 23, 2017 at 9:33 PM
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Royale name

I know it's too late and I'm really not trying to be a pest, but as a marketing guy I wanted to add in this discussion topic (http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/DISCUSS-Name-of-the-FlexJS-Fork-td64199i60.html#a64289) Justin M. Hill makes the most sense. Even people who no longer use Flex would probably know what FlexJS could be about (like me) but Apache Royale? I had a quick look at the subscribers of the Apache Flex User mailing list even they seem confused, imagine the rest of us.
Google Trends indicates to me Royale 1. is not a widely used term, 2. the searched term does not seem to have a significant relation with computing (except for a game).
Mandeep

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 7:50 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:
my opinion is not important, 1 person does not make a focus group. I learned of the name change today because someone approached the company I work for to discuss a Flex app conversion. But a search with Google Trends may give more insight.

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Carlos Rovira <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutinallure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.
Mandeep



Virus-free. www.avg.com




--

Carlos Rovira
Director General
M: +34 607 22 60 05
http://www.codeoscopic.com

Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!

Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.
De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.





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Re: Royale name

Carlos Rovira
Hi Nicolas,

you're right Flash is perceive like something "bad", but we'll know that's not true, but is something that was feed through the years and now is impossible to remove. Flex is collateral damage, IT people knows that Flex means in the end Flash, for this reason Flex has been fading out through all this years. So nothing to do here.

The best strategy is to make something fresh, and better not to say "Flash Player free" (this message would be bad for people that does not know about us, we will hurting ourself unnecessarily) but "HTML output ready", "HTML generation" or whatever sounds good (didn't think about the right sentence with best marketing sounding.







2017-10-24 10:26 GMT+02:00 Idylog - Nicolas Granon <[hidden email]>:
Many thanks for this information.
I must say that the distinction was not very clear to me neither…

Maybe there is some confusion between the “Flex” concept (most people outside Flex developers never heard about it, and Flex developers usually have a good feeling about it) and the “Flash Player” concept (about which absolutely everybody have heard of, as being “bad” and “old” and “evil” and “anti-Apple” thus being anti-anything-modern since Apple equals “modern” in the mind of the public).

That is the reason why I do not believe that citing Flex necessarily associates it with “old” (after all, js is much older!).
What we want is something AS3 + MXML, keeping what made Flex shine, but definitely “Flash Player-free”. Maybe a “Flash Player free” sticker would attract more users ?

Nicolas Granon



De : Alex Harui [mailto:[hidden email]]
Envoyé : mardi 24 octobre 2017 07:05
À : [hidden email]
Objet : Re: Royale name

Hi Mandeep,

IMO, there are two target markets for Royale:  1) people migrating Flex apps.  2) People looking to create new JS apps who have no idea what Flex is or think Flex is "old".

Also, at least at Apache, there can a difference between a PROJECT name and a PRODUCT name.

As you can see from the discussion, folks looking to target the second group are concerned about association with the name "Flex".  I could be wrong, but I am hopeful that the big push to migrate Flex apps will not last much beyond 2020.  It is extremely difficult to rebrand and rename a PROJECT "later", so we gambled and picked a name for the PROJECT that had no association with "Flex".  However, I am still pushing for us to have a PRODUCT named FlexJS as well as a PRODUCT named Royale in order to target both groups.  And, if the FlexJS PRODUCT isn't of interest to many folks after 2020, we can retire that one PRODUCT without having to rebrand the PROJECT.

We simply have not published enough stuff on any official web sites in order to get the search engines to find us in the noise, so yeah, we are currently hard to find.  We are always interested in volunteers helping out in drawing attention to Royale.

And we are always interested in your and other's thoughts on everything related to Royale, including your posts on this topic.  The only thing that is unlikely to change is the PROJECT name, but you can still influence PRODUCT names and how we market.

Thoughts?
-Alex

From: Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Date: Monday, October 23, 2017 at 9:33 PM
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Royale name

I know it's too late and I'm really not trying to be a pest, but as a marketing guy I wanted to add in this discussion topic (http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/DISCUSS-Name-of-the-FlexJS-Fork-td64199i60.html#a64289) Justin M. Hill makes the most sense. Even people who no longer use Flex would probably know what FlexJS could be about (like me) but Apache Royale? I had a quick look at the subscribers of the Apache Flex User mailing list even they seem confused, imagine the rest of us.
Google Trends indicates to me Royale 1. is not a widely used term, 2. the searched term does not seem to have a significant relation with computing (except for a game).
Mandeep

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 7:50 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:
my opinion is not important, 1 person does not make a focus group. I learned of the name change today because someone approached the company I work for to discuss a Flex app conversion. But a search with Google Trends may give more insight.

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Carlos Rovira <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutinallure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.
Mandeep



Virus-free. www.avg.com




--

Carlos Rovira
Director General
M: <a href="tel:%2B34%20607%2022%2060%2005" value="+34607226005">+34 607 22 60 05
http://www.codeoscopic.com

Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!

Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.
De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.








--

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: +34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com


Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!


Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.

De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.


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Re: Royale name

Mandeep Sarma
In reply to this post by Alex Harui-2
When I was referring to Google trends I was trying to say people using the word "royale" in their searches are not looking for computing related information. I personally like names that either say what the product / service is about or at least invokes a relate-able meaning. For example a quick  Google trends search seems to indicate interest in MS's Xamarin is dropping, I think it some of it has to do with the odd ball name which makes it hard to remember. As a marketing guy with a "many :)" few years of experience I will only make 1 suggestion: marketing wise it's dangerous for individuals or a group to assume our personal perception is the same as the rest of the world's.

Anecdotally speaking and not based on any research, I think rightly or wrongly the Flash Player has a bad name, but "flex" does not seem to have any negative connotations. Again according to Google Trends (what can I say, I like facts) "flex" is a widely used term associated with technology and lifestyle brands. new is not always good (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/30-years-ago-today-coca-cola-new-coke-failure/). So my 2 cents is I personally like FlexJS, to people who know Flex they will know it mean Flex for JS, for people not familiar with Flex they may associated it with some / another "flexible" JS technology which may prompt further consideration.  But for people with no knowledge of Adobe Flex or Apache Flex, Apache Royale will be equal to an unlit light bulb in their heads. I'm one person not a focus group but when I started reading about Apache Royale I was confused, I had always assumed Apache Flex was an intermediary solution with FlexJS being the future (yeap I made an assumption), I guess it's still is, but it just became very convoluted.

I'm not trying to muddy the waters just sharing my 2 cents 100% for a marketer's point of view.

Mandeep

On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 1:05 AM, Alex Harui <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

IMO, there are two target markets for Royale:  1) people migrating Flex apps.  2) People looking to create new JS apps who have no idea what Flex is or think Flex is "old".

Also, at least at Apache, there can a difference between a PROJECT name and a PRODUCT name.

As you can see from the discussion, folks looking to target the second group are concerned about association with the name "Flex".  I could be wrong, but I am hopeful that the big push to migrate Flex apps will not last much beyond 2020.  It is extremely difficult to rebrand and rename a PROJECT "later", so we gambled and picked a name for the PROJECT that had no association with "Flex".  However, I am still pushing for us to have a PRODUCT named FlexJS as well as a PRODUCT named Royale in order to target both groups.  And, if the FlexJS PRODUCT isn't of interest to many folks after 2020, we can retire that one PRODUCT without having to rebrand the PROJECT.

We simply have not published enough stuff on any official web sites in order to get the search engines to find us in the noise, so yeah, we are currently hard to find.  We are always interested in volunteers helping out in drawing attention to Royale.

And we are always interested in your and other's thoughts on everything related to Royale, including your posts on this topic.  The only thing that is unlikely to change is the PROJECT name, but you can still influence PRODUCT names and how we market.

Thoughts?
-Alex

From: Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Date: Monday, October 23, 2017 at 9:33 PM
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Royale name

I know it's too late and I'm really not trying to be a pest, but as a marketing guy I wanted to add in this discussion topic (http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/DISCUSS-Name-of-the-FlexJS-Fork-td64199i60.html#a64289) Justin M. Hill makes the most sense. Even people who no longer use Flex would probably know what FlexJS could be about (like me) but Apache Royale? I had a quick look at the subscribers of the Apache Flex User mailing list even they seem confused, imagine the rest of us.
Google Trends indicates to me Royale 1. is not a widely used term, 2. the searched term does not seem to have a significant relation with computing (except for a game).

Mandeep

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 7:50 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:
my opinion is not important, 1 person does not make a focus group. I learned of the name change today because someone approached the company I work for to discuss a Flex app conversion. But a search with Google Trends may give more insight.

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Carlos Rovira <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutinallure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.

Mandeep

Virus-free. www.avg.com



--

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: <a href="tel:+34%20607%2022%2060%2005" value="+34607226005" target="_blank">+34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com


Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!


Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.

De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.





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Re: Royale name

Peter Ent
Just to play Devil’s Advocate a bit: Before the mid-1990s no one knew what “google” was when that company started. “Google” did not, to the average person or even programmers of that time, associate with anything to do with computers. 

There are hundreds of products and brands names that initially are not linked with, or say, what they provide. I’m sure within a few years “Royale”, in the context of computing, will come to be associated with cross platform solutions. 

Peter 


On Oct 24, 2017, at 7:24 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:

When I was referring to Google trends I was trying to say people using the word "royale" in their searches are not looking for computing related information. I personally like names that either say what the product / service is about or at least invokes a relate-able meaning. For example a quick  Google trends search seems to indicate interest in MS's Xamarin is dropping, I think it some of it has to do with the odd ball name which makes it hard to remember. As a marketing guy with a "many :)" few years of experience I will only make 1 suggestion: marketing wise it's dangerous for individuals or a group to assume our personal perception is the same as the rest of the world's.

Anecdotally speaking and not based on any research, I think rightly or wrongly the Flash Player has a bad name, but "flex" does not seem to have any negative connotations. Again according to Google Trends (what can I say, I like facts) "flex" is a widely used term associated with technology and lifestyle brands. new is not always good (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/30-years-ago-today-coca-cola-new-coke-failure/). So my 2 cents is I personally like FlexJS, to people who know Flex they will know it mean Flex for JS, for people not familiar with Flex they may associated it with some / another "flexible" JS technology which may prompt further consideration.  But for people with no knowledge of Adobe Flex or Apache Flex, Apache Royale will be equal to an unlit light bulb in their heads. I'm one person not a focus group but when I started reading about Apache Royale I was confused, I had always assumed Apache Flex was an intermediary solution with FlexJS being the future (yeap I made an assumption), I guess it's still is, but it just became very convoluted.

I'm not trying to muddy the waters just sharing my 2 cents 100% for a marketer's point of view.

Mandeep

On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 1:05 AM, Alex Harui <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

IMO, there are two target markets for Royale:  1) people migrating Flex apps.  2) People looking to create new JS apps who have no idea what Flex is or think Flex is "old".

Also, at least at Apache, there can a difference between a PROJECT name and a PRODUCT name.

As you can see from the discussion, folks looking to target the second group are concerned about association with the name "Flex".  I could be wrong, but I am hopeful that the big push to migrate Flex apps will not last much beyond 2020.  It is extremely difficult to rebrand and rename a PROJECT "later", so we gambled and picked a name for the PROJECT that had no association with "Flex".  However, I am still pushing for us to have a PRODUCT named FlexJS as well as a PRODUCT named Royale in order to target both groups.  And, if the FlexJS PRODUCT isn't of interest to many folks after 2020, we can retire that one PRODUCT without having to rebrand the PROJECT.

We simply have not published enough stuff on any official web sites in order to get the search engines to find us in the noise, so yeah, we are currently hard to find.  We are always interested in volunteers helping out in drawing attention to Royale.

And we are always interested in your and other's thoughts on everything related to Royale, including your posts on this topic.  The only thing that is unlikely to change is the PROJECT name, but you can still influence PRODUCT names and how we market.

Thoughts?
-Alex

From: Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Date: Monday, October 23, 2017 at 9:33 PM
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Royale name

I know it's too late and I'm really not trying to be a pest, but as a marketing guy I wanted to add in this discussion topic (http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/DISCUSS-Name-of-the-FlexJS-Fork-td64199i60.html#a64289) Justin M. Hill makes the most sense. Even people who no longer use Flex would probably know what FlexJS could be about (like me) but Apache Royale? I had a quick look at the subscribers of the Apache Flex User mailing list even they seem confused, imagine the rest of us.
Google Trends indicates to me Royale 1. is not a widely used term, 2. the searched term does not seem to have a significant relation with computing (except for a game).

Mandeep

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 7:50 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:
my opinion is not important, 1 person does not make a focus group. I learned of the name change today because someone approached the company I work for to discuss a Flex app conversion. But a search with Google Trends may give more insight.

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Carlos Rovira <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutinallure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.

Mandeep

Virus-free. www.avg.com



--

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: <a href="tel:&#43;34%20607%2022%2060%2005" value="&#43;34607226005" target="_blank">+34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com


Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!


Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.

De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.





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Re: Royale name

Mandeep Sarma
I don't think you are making a good comparison, ie why has Tesla Motors become so recognizable? among many reason the fact that it was one of the first all electric cars to be a viable every day car for some people (I know Google was not the first search engine, but it was the first with a clean UI). But have you heard of "GAC" most Americans haven't. GAC is Chinese auto maker that has made several unsuccessful attempts at entering the USA's auto market.  I'm 99.99% sure when the first mass market humanoid robot hits the shelves that what ever name they give it will become well know even if they call it Xamarin (trying to be funny).

On a serious note, I assure you my comments were not meant to offend or challenge anyone's wisdom. I have repeatedly said I'm not a focus group and certainly not a prophet. I simply wanted to share my point of view as someone in marketing, I was doing research for client on FlexJS and I got confused by the latest developments.  But if Apache Royale becomes a huge success and I'm invited to the party, I will accept the invitation. (not being sarcastic, just saying I enjoy a good party)

Cheers!
Mandeep

On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 9:36 PM, Peter Ent <[hidden email]> wrote:
Just to play Devil’s Advocate a bit: Before the mid-1990s no one knew what “google” was when that company started. “Google” did not, to the average person or even programmers of that time, associate with anything to do with computers. 

There are hundreds of products and brands names that initially are not linked with, or say, what they provide. I’m sure within a few years “Royale”, in the context of computing, will come to be associated with cross platform solutions. 

Peter 


On Oct 24, 2017, at 7:24 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:

When I was referring to Google trends I was trying to say people using the word "royale" in their searches are not looking for computing related information. I personally like names that either say what the product / service is about or at least invokes a relate-able meaning. For example a quick  Google trends search seems to indicate interest in MS's Xamarin is dropping, I think it some of it has to do with the odd ball name which makes it hard to remember. As a marketing guy with a "many :)" few years of experience I will only make 1 suggestion: marketing wise it's dangerous for individuals or a group to assume our personal perception is the same as the rest of the world's.

Anecdotally speaking and not based on any research, I think rightly or wrongly the Flash Player has a bad name, but "flex" does not seem to have any negative connotations. Again according to Google Trends (what can I say, I like facts) "flex" is a widely used term associated with technology and lifestyle brands. new is not always good (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/30-years-ago-today-coca-cola-new-coke-failure/). So my 2 cents is I personally like FlexJS, to people who know Flex they will know it mean Flex for JS, for people not familiar with Flex they may associated it with some / another "flexible" JS technology which may prompt further consideration.  But for people with no knowledge of Adobe Flex or Apache Flex, Apache Royale will be equal to an unlit light bulb in their heads. I'm one person not a focus group but when I started reading about Apache Royale I was confused, I had always assumed Apache Flex was an intermediary solution with FlexJS being the future (yeap I made an assumption), I guess it's still is, but it just became very convoluted.

I'm not trying to muddy the waters just sharing my 2 cents 100% for a marketer's point of view.

Mandeep

On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 1:05 AM, Alex Harui <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

IMO, there are two target markets for Royale:  1) people migrating Flex apps.  2) People looking to create new JS apps who have no idea what Flex is or think Flex is "old".

Also, at least at Apache, there can a difference between a PROJECT name and a PRODUCT name.

As you can see from the discussion, folks looking to target the second group are concerned about association with the name "Flex".  I could be wrong, but I am hopeful that the big push to migrate Flex apps will not last much beyond 2020.  It is extremely difficult to rebrand and rename a PROJECT "later", so we gambled and picked a name for the PROJECT that had no association with "Flex".  However, I am still pushing for us to have a PRODUCT named FlexJS as well as a PRODUCT named Royale in order to target both groups.  And, if the FlexJS PRODUCT isn't of interest to many folks after 2020, we can retire that one PRODUCT without having to rebrand the PROJECT.

We simply have not published enough stuff on any official web sites in order to get the search engines to find us in the noise, so yeah, we are currently hard to find.  We are always interested in volunteers helping out in drawing attention to Royale.

And we are always interested in your and other's thoughts on everything related to Royale, including your posts on this topic.  The only thing that is unlikely to change is the PROJECT name, but you can still influence PRODUCT names and how we market.

Thoughts?
-Alex

From: Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Date: Monday, October 23, 2017 at 9:33 PM
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Royale name

I know it's too late and I'm really not trying to be a pest, but as a marketing guy I wanted to add in this discussion topic (http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/DISCUSS-Name-of-the-FlexJS-Fork-td64199i60.html#a64289) Justin M. Hill makes the most sense. Even people who no longer use Flex would probably know what FlexJS could be about (like me) but Apache Royale? I had a quick look at the subscribers of the Apache Flex User mailing list even they seem confused, imagine the rest of us.
Google Trends indicates to me Royale 1. is not a widely used term, 2. the searched term does not seem to have a significant relation with computing (except for a game).

Mandeep

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 7:50 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:
my opinion is not important, 1 person does not make a focus group. I learned of the name change today because someone approached the company I work for to discuss a Flex app conversion. But a search with Google Trends may give more insight.

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Carlos Rovira <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutinallure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.

Mandeep

Virus-free. www.avg.com



--

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: <a href="tel:+34%20607%2022%2060%2005" value="+34607226005" target="_blank">+34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com


Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!


Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.

De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.






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Re: Royale name

Dave Fisher
I suppose you’ve heard of Tesla the man who brought us electricity? He worked for Edison and Westinghouse and designed the first hydroelectric plant at Niagara falls.


Perhaps we should call this Warnock?

Kidding.

Regards,
Dave

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 24, 2017, at 7:51 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:

I don't think you are making a good comparison, ie why has Tesla Motors become so recognizable? among many reason the fact that it was one of the first all electric cars to be a viable every day car for some people (I know Google was not the first search engine, but it was the first with a clean UI). But have you heard of "GAC" most Americans haven't. GAC is Chinese auto maker that has made several unsuccessful attempts at entering the USA's auto market.  I'm 99.99% sure when the first mass market humanoid robot hits the shelves that what ever name they give it will become well know even if they call it Xamarin (trying to be funny).

On a serious note, I assure you my comments were not meant to offend or challenge anyone's wisdom. I have repeatedly said I'm not a focus group and certainly not a prophet. I simply wanted to share my point of view as someone in marketing, I was doing research for client on FlexJS and I got confused by the latest developments.  But if Apache Royale becomes a huge success and I'm invited to the party, I will accept the invitation. (not being sarcastic, just saying I enjoy a good party)

Cheers!
Mandeep

On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 9:36 PM, Peter Ent <[hidden email]> wrote:
Just to play Devil’s Advocate a bit: Before the mid-1990s no one knew what “google” was when that company started. “Google” did not, to the average person or even programmers of that time, associate with anything to do with computers. 

There are hundreds of products and brands names that initially are not linked with, or say, what they provide. I’m sure within a few years “Royale”, in the context of computing, will come to be associated with cross platform solutions. 

Peter 


On Oct 24, 2017, at 7:24 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:

When I was referring to Google trends I was trying to say people using the word "royale" in their searches are not looking for computing related information. I personally like names that either say what the product / service is about or at least invokes a relate-able meaning. For example a quick  Google trends search seems to indicate interest in MS's Xamarin is dropping, I think it some of it has to do with the odd ball name which makes it hard to remember. As a marketing guy with a "many :)" few years of experience I will only make 1 suggestion: marketing wise it's dangerous for individuals or a group to assume our personal perception is the same as the rest of the world's.

Anecdotally speaking and not based on any research, I think rightly or wrongly the Flash Player has a bad name, but "flex" does not seem to have any negative connotations. Again according to Google Trends (what can I say, I like facts) "flex" is a widely used term associated with technology and lifestyle brands. new is not always good (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/30-years-ago-today-coca-cola-new-coke-failure/). So my 2 cents is I personally like FlexJS, to people who know Flex they will know it mean Flex for JS, for people not familiar with Flex they may associated it with some / another "flexible" JS technology which may prompt further consideration.  But for people with no knowledge of Adobe Flex or Apache Flex, Apache Royale will be equal to an unlit light bulb in their heads. I'm one person not a focus group but when I started reading about Apache Royale I was confused, I had always assumed Apache Flex was an intermediary solution with FlexJS being the future (yeap I made an assumption), I guess it's still is, but it just became very convoluted.

I'm not trying to muddy the waters just sharing my 2 cents 100% for a marketer's point of view.

Mandeep

On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 1:05 AM, Alex Harui <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

IMO, there are two target markets for Royale:  1) people migrating Flex apps.  2) People looking to create new JS apps who have no idea what Flex is or think Flex is "old".

Also, at least at Apache, there can a difference between a PROJECT name and a PRODUCT name.

As you can see from the discussion, folks looking to target the second group are concerned about association with the name "Flex".  I could be wrong, but I am hopeful that the big push to migrate Flex apps will not last much beyond 2020.  It is extremely difficult to rebrand and rename a PROJECT "later", so we gambled and picked a name for the PROJECT that had no association with "Flex".  However, I am still pushing for us to have a PRODUCT named FlexJS as well as a PRODUCT named Royale in order to target both groups.  And, if the FlexJS PRODUCT isn't of interest to many folks after 2020, we can retire that one PRODUCT without having to rebrand the PROJECT.

We simply have not published enough stuff on any official web sites in order to get the search engines to find us in the noise, so yeah, we are currently hard to find.  We are always interested in volunteers helping out in drawing attention to Royale.

And we are always interested in your and other's thoughts on everything related to Royale, including your posts on this topic.  The only thing that is unlikely to change is the PROJECT name, but you can still influence PRODUCT names and how we market.

Thoughts?
-Alex

From: Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Date: Monday, October 23, 2017 at 9:33 PM
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Royale name

I know it's too late and I'm really not trying to be a pest, but as a marketing guy I wanted to add in this discussion topic (http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/DISCUSS-Name-of-the-FlexJS-Fork-td64199i60.html#a64289) Justin M. Hill makes the most sense. Even people who no longer use Flex would probably know what FlexJS could be about (like me) but Apache Royale? I had a quick look at the subscribers of the Apache Flex User mailing list even they seem confused, imagine the rest of us.
Google Trends indicates to me Royale 1. is not a widely used term, 2. the searched term does not seem to have a significant relation with computing (except for a game).

Mandeep

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 7:50 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:
my opinion is not important, 1 person does not make a focus group. I learned of the name change today because someone approached the company I work for to discuss a Flex app conversion. But a search with Google Trends may give more insight.

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Carlos Rovira <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutinallure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.

Mandeep

Virus-free. www.avg.com



--

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: <a href="tel:+34%20607%2022%2060%2005" value="+34607226005" target="_blank">+34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com


Conocenos Avant2 en 1 minuto!


Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.

De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación necesaria.






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Re: Royale name

Alex Harui-2
In reply to this post by Mandeep Sarma
Hi Mandeep,

We are still trying to get to a sufficient web presence for Royale.  So yeah, search engines are not going to be helpful to Royale right now.  I think we will have a PRODUCT named FlexJS and we welcome your and anyone else's thoughts on how we should market the PROJECT Royale and its PRODUCTS.

Thanks,
-Alex

From: Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 7:51 PM
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Royale name

I don't think you are making a good comparison, ie why has Tesla Motors become so recognizable? among many reason the fact that it was one of the first all electric cars to be a viable every day car for some people (I know Google was not the first search engine, but it was the first with a clean UI). But have you heard of "GAC" most Americans haven't. GAC is Chinese auto maker that has made several unsuccessful attempts at entering the USA's auto market.  I'm 99.99% sure when the first mass market humanoid robot hits the shelves that what ever name they give it will become well know even if they call it Xamarin (trying to be funny).

On a serious note, I assure you my comments were not meant to offend or challenge anyone's wisdom. I have repeatedly said I'm not a focus group and certainly not a prophet. I simply wanted to share my point of view as someone in marketing, I was doing research for client on FlexJS and I got confused by the latest developments.  But if Apache Royale becomes a huge success and I'm invited to the party, I will accept the invitation. (not being sarcastic, just saying I enjoy a good party)

Cheers!
Mandeep

On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 9:36 PM, Peter Ent <[hidden email]> wrote:
Just to play Devil’s Advocate a bit: Before the mid-1990s no one knew what “google” was when that company started. “Google” did not, to the average person or even programmers of that time, associate with anything to do with computers. 

There are hundreds of products and brands names that initially are not linked with, or say, what they provide. I’m sure within a few years “Royale”, in the context of computing, will come to be associated with cross platform solutions. 

Peter 


On Oct 24, 2017, at 7:24 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:

When I was referring to Google trends I was trying to say people using the word "royale" in their searches are not looking for computing related information. I personally like names that either say what the product / service is about or at least invokes a relate-able meaning. For example a quick  Google trends search seems to indicate interest in MS's Xamarin is dropping, I think it some of it has to do with the odd ball name which makes it hard to remember. As a marketing guy with a "many :)" few years of experience I will only make 1 suggestion: marketing wise it's dangerous for individuals or a group to assume our personal perception is the same as the rest of the world's.

Anecdotally speaking and not based on any research, I think rightly or wrongly the Flash Player has a bad name, but "flex" does not seem to have any negative connotations. Again according to Google Trends (what can I say, I like facts) "flex" is a widely used term associated with technology and lifestyle brands. new is not always good (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/30-years-ago-today-coca-cola-new-coke-failure/). So my 2 cents is I personally like FlexJS, to people who know Flex they will know it mean Flex for JS, for people not familiar with Flex they may associated it with some / another "flexible" JS technology which may prompt further consideration.  But for people with no knowledge of Adobe Flex or Apache Flex, Apache Royale will be equal to an unlit light bulb in their heads. I'm one person not a focus group but when I started reading about Apache Royale I was confused, I had always assumed Apache Flex was an intermediary solution with FlexJS being the future (yeap I made an assumption), I guess it's still is, but it just became very convoluted.

I'm not trying to muddy the waters just sharing my 2 cents 100% for a marketer's point of view.

Mandeep

On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 1:05 AM, Alex Harui <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

IMO, there are two target markets for Royale:  1) people migrating Flex apps.  2) People looking to create new JS apps who have no idea what Flex is or think Flex is "old".

Also, at least at Apache, there can a difference between a PROJECT name and a PRODUCT name.

As you can see from the discussion, folks looking to target the second group are concerned about association with the name "Flex".  I could be wrong, but I am hopeful that the big push to migrate Flex apps will not last much beyond 2020.  It is extremely difficult to rebrand and rename a PROJECT "later", so we gambled and picked a name for the PROJECT that had no association with "Flex".  However, I am still pushing for us to have a PRODUCT named FlexJS as well as a PRODUCT named Royale in order to target both groups.  And, if the FlexJS PRODUCT isn't of interest to many folks after 2020, we can retire that one PRODUCT without having to rebrand the PROJECT.

We simply have not published enough stuff on any official web sites in order to get the search engines to find us in the noise, so yeah, we are currently hard to find.  We are always interested in volunteers helping out in drawing attention to Royale.

And we are always interested in your and other's thoughts on everything related to Royale, including your posts on this topic.  The only thing that is unlikely to change is the PROJECT name, but you can still influence PRODUCT names and how we market.

Thoughts?
-Alex

From: Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Date: Monday, October 23, 2017 at 9:33 PM
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Royale name

I know it's too late and I'm really not trying to be a pest, but as a marketing guy I wanted to add in this discussion topic (http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/DISCUSS-Name-of-the-FlexJS-Fork-td64199i60.html#a64289) Justin M. Hill makes the most sense. Even people who no longer use Flex would probably know what FlexJS could be about (like me) but Apache Royale? I had a quick look at the subscribers of the Apache Flex User mailing list even they seem confused, imagine the rest of us.
Google Trends indicates to me Royale 1. is not a widely used term, 2. the searched term does not seem to have a significant relation with computing (except for a game).

Mandeep

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 7:50 PM, Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]> wrote:
my opinion is not important, 1 person does not make a focus group. I learned of the name change today because someone approached the company I work for to discuss a Flex app conversion. But a search with Google Trends may give more insight.

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Carlos Rovira <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Mandeep,

this topic was largely discussed in dev list. This name was the original codename for Flex when it was created around 2001 in Macromedia. Then Macromedia changed it to the final name Flex when it was released. We think that this name has a great sounding and good meaning in terms of something "magnificent", "marvelous" or "great", and and  like it was explained in the change name thread.

we are in royale dev list proping a new web site for Apache Royale here: http://royale.codeoscopic.com

Hope you like it

Thanks

Carlos




2017-10-23 22:54 GMT+02:00 Mandeep Sarma <[hidden email]>:
is there are meaning or significance in the Apache Royale name. from a marketing perspective it seems like a strange name. Royale is a French word often used in English to give an highfalutinallure often ironically, and a popular joke in the Pulp Fiction movie. Apache Royal does not seem to invoke any link to any topic involving technology.

Can you imagine if Apple had name it's smart phone Apple Royale ? Nokia might still have been the #1 mobile phone maker today.

I'm NOT criticizing I'm just curious as to the significance of the name.

Mandeep

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